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Gravitational shielding: The Cavourite problem
20 years 10 months ago #7913
by Jan
Replied by Jan on topic Reply from Jan Vink
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by EBTX</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Extracting energy from gravitons (once we learn how) is no different in kind. -|Tom|<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
One could not, in principle, extract energy from a "uniform" sea of energetic gravitons regardless of what type they were ... for the same reason that one cannot extract energy from a heat sink at uniform temperature.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
What do you mean by "heat"? Infrared photons, molecular motions, or something else?
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Extracting energy from gravitons (once we learn how) is no different in kind. -|Tom|<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
One could not, in principle, extract energy from a "uniform" sea of energetic gravitons regardless of what type they were ... for the same reason that one cannot extract energy from a heat sink at uniform temperature.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
What do you mean by "heat"? Infrared photons, molecular motions, or something else?
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20 years 10 months ago #7858
by EBTX
Replied by EBTX on topic Reply from
By heat I mean any kind of energy whatsoever. Anything you care to name ;o)
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- tvanflandern
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20 years 10 months ago #8123
by tvanflandern
Replied by tvanflandern on topic Reply from Tom Van Flandern
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by EBTX</i>
<br />One could not, in principle, extract energy from a "uniform" sea of energetic gravitons regardless of what type they were ... for the same reason that one cannot extract energy from a heat sink at uniform temperature. By heat I mean any kind of energy whatsoever.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The example that started this thread is a counterexample to your assertion. How do you reconcile these? -|Tom|-
<br />One could not, in principle, extract energy from a "uniform" sea of energetic gravitons regardless of what type they were ... for the same reason that one cannot extract energy from a heat sink at uniform temperature. By heat I mean any kind of energy whatsoever.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The example that started this thread is a counterexample to your assertion. How do you reconcile these? -|Tom|-
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- Larry Burford
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20 years 10 months ago #7863
by Larry Burford
Replied by Larry Burford on topic Reply from Larry Burford
edit - remove reference to other perpetual motion device - shield property of Covourite is different from real matter.
Dr. Van Flandern,
Your device would obviously work on Earth's surface (where the graviton flux is not uniform ), but out in deep space (where the flux is uniform) I don't see a way avoid EBTX's conclusion relative to this design.
EBTX moved the goal post while you were looking away. Tricky.
===
This would seem to bring into question the use of simple (ie omni-directional) shielding as a general purpose means of extracting energy from the graviton flux.
However, Gregg Wilson posted some interesting speculations recently (in several threads titled "Atomic Hydrogen and ...") centered on the possibility of non-spherical geometry in addition to shielding.
To summarize his thesis:
* If protons are so dense that few gravitons can pass through them (large shielding factor)
* and if they are shaped like a conical prism
* then a uniform graviton flux will push them around in the direction of their points.
All you have to do is look at an anemometer to see that it can work. So I'd say THIS is the nail in the coffin of EBTX's challenge.
===
The rest of Gregg's speculations are equally interesting, but far from complete.
(Gregg, any more stuff along this line?)
Regards,
LB
Dr. Van Flandern,
Your device would obviously work on Earth's surface (where the graviton flux is not uniform ), but out in deep space (where the flux is uniform) I don't see a way avoid EBTX's conclusion relative to this design.
EBTX moved the goal post while you were looking away. Tricky.
===
This would seem to bring into question the use of simple (ie omni-directional) shielding as a general purpose means of extracting energy from the graviton flux.
However, Gregg Wilson posted some interesting speculations recently (in several threads titled "Atomic Hydrogen and ...") centered on the possibility of non-spherical geometry in addition to shielding.
To summarize his thesis:
* If protons are so dense that few gravitons can pass through them (large shielding factor)
* and if they are shaped like a conical prism
* then a uniform graviton flux will push them around in the direction of their points.
All you have to do is look at an anemometer to see that it can work. So I'd say THIS is the nail in the coffin of EBTX's challenge.
===
The rest of Gregg's speculations are equally interesting, but far from complete.
(Gregg, any more stuff along this line?)
Regards,
LB
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