Quantized redshift anomaly

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
<br />... gravitons simply exist.
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I am widely careful and skeptic.

I was mainly a theoretician in quantum mechanics, but I NEVER needed the "Copenhagen principles", and the quantization of light; a fortiori, I think that the quantization of gravity is useless.

The supporters of Copenhagen principles and quantum electrodynamics (QED) are not more serious than the supporters of the big bang. Among their dissimulations:

- The "wave-particle duality" is founded on the hidden hypothesis that the wave obeys LINEAR equations. Without this hypothesis, we obtain solitons which are waves and particles ...

- The beautiful experiments which show that "QED works where classical electrodynamics (CED) fails" are founded on an error in their classical computation which neglects the zero point field (ZPF). To back the negligence of the ZPF, they repeat and repeat that it is introduced by QED while it was evaluated by Nernst more than 10 year before the birth of QED.

- No EPR problem in CED, and quantum cryptography is a simple pump of money.

I am new to this forum and see it will take me quite some time to review
everything here but I do have an alternative therory that works remarkably well.
Simple as it is it started with the idea that what if a slower time, the sort of time slowing one gets with gravity, also contracted matter.You end up with a shorter meter stick that also ends you up with measuring more space such as the circumferences around a neutron star.This theory argues that its this effect that also expands space so it becomes relative if the meter stick got shorter or the space literally got more.
So this is simplistic and if true would explain how space can be created but how could one show that such an effect actually occurs.
So before I say anything more here is a gedanken fro you to look at and question for yourself.

Nearly everyone knows now that black holes and their extreme gravity
slow down time to an extreme at least to us outside observers so how do you show that it also contracts mater. About the easiest way
is by looking at the pole in barn thought experiment only this time we
also add a slowed down time within the barn.
To review this idea and skip ahead if you already know about this. Its
about how in relativity objects are supposed to measure shorter when
they travel and this is most significant as they approach light speed,
so why cant someone running fast enough with a rod longer than the barn
actually fit it all inside the barn with both doors closed for a brief
instance. Well it depends on where you are where the measurements are
made but no you cant do this so that all observers placed at every
location will agree that the rod was within the barn with booth doors
closed. Note that some arguments point out that from the rods prospective its the barn that's
traveling and so from the rods point of view its the barn that measures shorter.

SKIP TO HERE TO CONTINUE But if the barn has a
significant amount of slower time inside it by for example 2 small
black holes in rotation about each other so we have a clear path
between them and then do this experiment again. Then if you start with a rod of for example 40 meters and it enters a 10 meter long barn barn where the speed of light is reduced to the point that it takes 10 seconds to pass then we can not only fit this 40 meter rod inside the barn but take our time
and walk around to the front and let it out. All observers will agree
that both doors were closed. Having a light pulse enter the barn at the
same time for comparison and the light will take 10 seconds to exit
with the rod being somewhat slower, will be slightly behind.
By analogy light entering a glass rod will slow down and become
compressed much the way that runners on entering a tunnel and slowing
to a walk will bunch up closer together. On leaving the tunnel
returning to a run will again increase the distances between them.
Atoms and their component particles can behave the same way.

This means that the space inside the barn has indeed increased.

The slowing of light by gravity is called the Shapiro effect and it is what this thought experiment is based on. Note
that this is a relative thing and if you were to travel with the rod you would feel no acceleration and
you would see no change in light speed or physical lengths inside your frame of
reference. Light speed is considered invariant due to this. Its
inherently tied to time so you cant have a different speed of light
without the time being equally effected. Making a light clock where the ticks require light to travel a certain length can be used to
illustrate this connection.

Just to further clarify I to argue with other Usenet users that yes the shipiro effect dose bent the light and yes a bent path will result in the light taking longer to travel but there is an added time delay that is due to the gravity.Its that component of the time delay thats responsible for space expansion.

You can extrapolate this farther into explaining how our universe was created and yes it has testable predictions and gives other possible explanations for other epiphenomena such as an alternative way to explain how gravitational binding energy works and even a way to reverse entropy.
A lot more to this theory saved for later.
Dale

Knowledge of a question is Knowledge.Knowledge of an original question is original Knowledge.

&gt;created and yes it has testable predictions and gives other possible &gt;explanations for other epiphenomena
Sorry I meant phenomena not epiphenomena.Relying to much on spell check and not looking.

Knowledge of a question is Knowledge.Knowledge of an original question is original Knowledge.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">. Tom says gravitons, so where does the graviton get its energy?

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"Energy" is not a separate thing or even a useful concept when speaking of fundamentals. Your own kinetic energy might be zero relative to your surroundings, but is certainly huge relative to something at rest in the solar system because of your planet's rotation and orbital motion. Do you feel all that energy? Does it exist within you? I think not.

Gravitons likewise do not "get" energy. Because there is no absolute space, gravitons simply exist.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

This is very enlightening. I think. So energy is actually a difference of something. That is, my concept of a pure energy, or an energy not doing anything may not be possible. Yet my planet's orbital motion compared with a point way out i space certainy does create a difference and if we were to find a way to measure that difference the "energy" would be great. But do I feel it? Maybe that is why science does not know what gravity or magnetism or electricity is, because they are not really anything but a difference. Yet how come there can be a difference among the differences? Is it because of the way we measure the difference? And what about the fields, fields of magnetism, electrostatic fields, how is this difference being transmitted? What is being different in a photon? Seems to me that if all there is is what is in mundane physical space, located in a space, then we have no explanation how these differences can exist. But if there is something else besides ordinary mundane "in space" like a Inside empty space, a difference dimension, that these differences can exist at the interface of in space and inside space. So maybe there is a kind of Pure Energy after all. Motionless motion.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Tommy</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">. Tom says gravitons, so where does the graviton get its energy?

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Gravitons likewise do not "get" energy. Because there is no absolute space, gravitons simply exist.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

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This is very enlightening. I think. So energy is actually a difference of something. That is, my concept of a pure energy, or an energy not doing anything may not be possible. Yet my planet's orbital motion compared with a point way out i space certainy does create a difference and if we were to find a way to measure that difference the "energy" would be great.
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Forgive me if the quotes from other writes is not shown correctly I am new here.
I really still do do not know what gravity is but some clues are available.
Thought experiment.If you had a hypothetical space ship traveling very near light speed that cannot be slowed down, dragging a cable that could not be broken.Then ask what if the end of this cable were to pass by a black hole where the speed of light is only 1/2 of what it is for our space ship,what would happen.If the space ship cannot slow down or the cable break the end of the cable would drag on the entire black hole, otherwise the end of the cable would travel faster than light relative to any observer at that same orbit.That cant be allowed and note that this is true even if the end of the cable were only 1 atom in size.
This implies that there is something in nothing that links everything in that entire black hole to that tiny end of a cable, but what and how. Its not unreasonable to speculate that its the same physical property that prevents us from ever being able to accelerate even the thinest particle to even the slightest amount more than light speed,its dragging on our entire universe in the same way.

This has led to the idea that measuring the quantum vacuum or rather the zero point energy even on the tiniest particle would become like trying to measure the mass of a single link in an infinite long infinitely tight chain.Anyone who has ever tried to weigh a single link in a chain while its still a part of the chain can appreciate how this can be difficult and that just with an ordinary chain.
Note the extreme estimates for the energy of the zero point energy even around a single particle added up to so much that it was rejected by many.Would not be so extreme if it really did turn out that it really was just the energy in the sourounding universe that was being estimated.

So what this might mean is that everything is connected but it looks like there is something about zero point energy that works on another dimension that ignores distances i.e. non locality.similar to that observed with entangled photons but dealing with inertia and keeping the speed of light regulated.

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But do I feel it? Maybe that is why science does not know what gravity or magnetism or electricity is, because they are not really anything but a difference.
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You probably guessed right at least with gravity according to this alternative theory.This alternative theory implies that gravity is a result of difference in the quantum vacuum and these differences also effect time.Some examples where casimir plates are taken on a space ship to different locations in a gravity well were also used to examine these ideas.
But some time later on I started to think that if you had 2 boxes side by side filled with bouncing balls and one of the boxes had a slower rate of time in it that the one with slower time would tend to collect the most balls.Talk with some physicists and they pointed out that their may not be anything with a true rest mass if you go down far enough.In other words even if a block of metal has rest mass none of its fundamental particles do.
So could some of the questions about gravity be due to the slight time differences I don't know yet but its something extra to ask about.

Dale

Knowledge of a question is Knowledge.Knowledge of an original question is original Knowledge.

Forgot to emphasize the part of this alternative theory that relates the quantum vacuum and or zero point energy.You can never measure the differences because as soon as you change its concentration you also change the volume of the tools you would measure that difference with.
In other words increase the concentration of zero point energy or the quantum vacuum and you will contract matter and expand space.In this alternative theory its the quantum vacuum or zero point energy puts matter in its place so that space can exist.In other words if you could deplete and or shield all of the zero point energy away from a particle then that particle would swell up and also display a faster time.
And if differences in the concentration of the zero point energy gives us gravity then they become 2 sides of the same coin.Differences in the quantum vacuum gives gravity and then the same stuff that makes gravity is also responsible for space in this alternative theory.
Dale

Knowledge of a question is Knowledge.Knowledge of an original question is original Knowledge.