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Has CMB really been detected?
19 years 7 months ago #13174
by kcody
Replied by kcody on topic Reply from Kevin Cody
OK, I've read up a little bit further. In case anyone was curious, I was digging for whether there might have been some unsuspected local phenomenon occuring within the detector itself. Whether or not, though, more recent experiments indicate that there is indeed microwave radiation coming at us from somewhere in space.
That lays this one to rest for now.
It would be interesting, though, to try to build a detector sensitive enough to pick up the non-uniformity, -from the faint signal that reaches the ground-, to once and for all isolate whether any kind of strange interactions occur in the microwave band. Determining direction of any particular fluctuation would not be necessary. If -none- of the non-uniformity reaches the ground, then ground-based measurements are probably picking up something else entirely.
That lays this one to rest for now.
It would be interesting, though, to try to build a detector sensitive enough to pick up the non-uniformity, -from the faint signal that reaches the ground-, to once and for all isolate whether any kind of strange interactions occur in the microwave band. Determining direction of any particular fluctuation would not be necessary. If -none- of the non-uniformity reaches the ground, then ground-based measurements are probably picking up something else entirely.
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- lyndonashmore
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19 years 7 months ago #13336
by lyndonashmore
Replied by lyndonashmore on topic Reply from lyndon ashmore
Fascinating thing is that the 21cm Hydrogen line should be in the CMB curve. It isn't. The whole thing has been 'tweaked'. Has anyone seen the original data as a graph?
Cheers,
Lyndon
lyndon ashmore - bringing cosmology back down to earth.
Cheers,
Lyndon
lyndon ashmore - bringing cosmology back down to earth.
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- tvanflandern
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19 years 7 months ago #12587
by tvanflandern
Replied by tvanflandern on topic Reply from Tom Van Flandern
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lyndonashmore</i>
<br />Fascinating thing is that the 21cm Hydrogen line should be in the CMB curve. It isn't.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The plots (such as bustard.phys.nd.edu/Phys171/lectures/cmbr.html ) usually cut off at 21 cm, presumably because that is where they would deviate from blackbody. But the "background" radiation is close to zero contribution at that wavelength anyway.
Do you have some reason to believe that the line is missing from microwave data? -|Tom|-
<br />Fascinating thing is that the 21cm Hydrogen line should be in the CMB curve. It isn't.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The plots (such as bustard.phys.nd.edu/Phys171/lectures/cmbr.html ) usually cut off at 21 cm, presumably because that is where they would deviate from blackbody. But the "background" radiation is close to zero contribution at that wavelength anyway.
Do you have some reason to believe that the line is missing from microwave data? -|Tom|-
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19 years 7 months ago #13268
by JMB
Replied by JMB on topic Reply from Jacques Moret-Bailly
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lyndonashmore</i>
<br />Fascinating thing is that the 21cm Hydrogen line should be in the CMB curve. It isn't.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The plots (such as bustard.phys.nd.edu/Phys171/lectures/cmbr.html ) usually cut off at 21 cm, presumably because that is where they would deviate from blackbody. But the "background" radiation is close to zero contribution at that wavelength anyway.
Do you have some reason to believe that the line is missing from microwave data? -|Tom|-
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The CREIL effect (an elementary parametric effect) shows that in excited atomic hydrogen (H*), energy flows from the radiations having a high temperature (deduced from Planck's law) to the cooler radiations.
It works strongly inside the very low frequency radiations, explaining their thermal profile. There are two exceptions: the 21 cm line is very strong (therefore hot) but its redshift is not sufficient to reach very low frequencies. When the CMB reaches the Solar system, it meets H* which amplifies it (from the energy produced by the redshift of the solar light); as H* is produced by the cooling of the solar wind, itself issued from the corona, it is bound to the ecliptic; the observations show that the anisotropy of the CMB is bound to the ecliptic.
The presence of H* at the limits of the solar system is attested by the blueshift of the radio signals from the Pioneer probes which reach this region.
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by lyndonashmore</i>
<br />Fascinating thing is that the 21cm Hydrogen line should be in the CMB curve. It isn't.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">The plots (such as bustard.phys.nd.edu/Phys171/lectures/cmbr.html ) usually cut off at 21 cm, presumably because that is where they would deviate from blackbody. But the "background" radiation is close to zero contribution at that wavelength anyway.
Do you have some reason to believe that the line is missing from microwave data? -|Tom|-
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The CREIL effect (an elementary parametric effect) shows that in excited atomic hydrogen (H*), energy flows from the radiations having a high temperature (deduced from Planck's law) to the cooler radiations.
It works strongly inside the very low frequency radiations, explaining their thermal profile. There are two exceptions: the 21 cm line is very strong (therefore hot) but its redshift is not sufficient to reach very low frequencies. When the CMB reaches the Solar system, it meets H* which amplifies it (from the energy produced by the redshift of the solar light); as H* is produced by the cooling of the solar wind, itself issued from the corona, it is bound to the ecliptic; the observations show that the anisotropy of the CMB is bound to the ecliptic.
The presence of H* at the limits of the solar system is attested by the blueshift of the radio signals from the Pioneer probes which reach this region.
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19 years 6 months ago #13300
by metagirl
Replied by metagirl on topic Reply from Kim Roberts
I just came across the following article
www.newscientist.com/channel/space/mg18624975.500
The article starts of, "RIPPLES in the faint afterglow of the big bang do not seem to be scattered as randomly as expected. This casts doubt on the theory of inflation, a cornerstone of modern cosmology..."
This will add more to the controversy, I cannot wait until the the second year's worth of WMAP data is released.
Metagirl
The more I know, the less I know
www.newscientist.com/channel/space/mg18624975.500
The article starts of, "RIPPLES in the faint afterglow of the big bang do not seem to be scattered as randomly as expected. This casts doubt on the theory of inflation, a cornerstone of modern cosmology..."
This will add more to the controversy, I cannot wait until the the second year's worth of WMAP data is released.
Metagirl
The more I know, the less I know
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- rousejohnny
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19 years 6 months ago #14102
by rousejohnny
Replied by rousejohnny on topic Reply from Johnny Rouse
Thanks for the link Metagirl, Inflation will collapse within the next 5 years. How will the BB be saved???
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