Fundamental Particles

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Gregg</i>
<br />For the gravitational flux, does one kind of graviton suffice or do there have to be "several" different kinds of gravitons? ... For the light carrying medium, does one kind of elyson suffice or do there have to be "several" different kinds of elysons?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">One kind suffices. But all that is important is that we know what an average graviton or elyson looks like. Air molecules are mostly nitrogen, but some are not. That doesn't interfere with describing average air properties.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Is there any need or evidence for a graviton lifespan; that is must gravitons come into existence or cease to exist? ... Is there any need or evidence for an elyson lifespan; that is must elysons come into existence or cease to exist?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">All forms in the Meta Model universe are finite, but that fact is irrelevant for practical purposes. Air molecules won't last forever either, but that last so long that we don't see the changes. The same for gravitons and elysons, whose lifetimes are probably many orders of magnitude longer than the age of the Earth. -|Tom|-

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
<br />[One kind suffices. But all that is important is that we know what an average graviton or elyson looks like. Air molecules are mostly nitrogen, but some are not. That doesn't interfere with describing average air properties.<hr noshade size="1">

Molecular nitrogen and molecular oxygen are quite distinct from one another in physical parameters, structure and chemical behavior. And they are not fundamental particles; they are structures. If one wants to quantify the properties of a molecular atmosphere, the constituents must be assessed. If you are simply saying that gravitons might vary in mass or size, then I would better understand your point. Narrowing my question: Reality doesn't need different kinds of gravitons to perform different functions in order to give different results?


<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">All forms in the Meta Model universe are finite, but that fact is irrelevant for practical purposes. Air molecules won't last forever either, but they last so long that we don't see the changes. The same for gravitons and elysons, whose lifetimes are probably many orders of magnitude longer than the age of the Earth. -|Tom|-
[/quote]<hr noshade size="1">

For practical purposes, air molecules do not last long enough for it to be said that there are no changes. Oxygen is extremely reactive whereas nitrogen is not. If the oxygen content of the air drops to 16%, a person will collapse and become unconscious. The presumed duration of air molecules, for practical purposes, is momentary. Industrially, pure nitrogen and oxygen are obtained by means of their physical difference.

It would appear that there are no lifespans to gravitons and elysons that effect the structure of planets, stars, galaxies, etc. Actual experimental testing found no lifespan for protons. The test established that, if a proton has a half-life, it is in excess of 10^34 years. This is longer then the presumed lifespans of all structures we are aware of in the Universe.

So, physically, the duration of gravitons, elysons and protons is long enough to make no difference to all that we observe. Therefore the construction and destruction of all these forms does not involve or require the construction or destruction of these three particles: the graviton, the elyson and the proton.


Gregg Wilson

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Gregg</i>
<br />Narrowing my question: Reality doesn't need different kinds of gravitons to perform different functions in order to give different results?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Correct. -|Tom|-

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Gregg</i>
<br />Narrowing my question: Reality doesn't need different kinds of gravitons to perform different functions in order to give different results?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Correct. -|Tom|-

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Presumably an elyson is about 20 orders of magnitude smaller in size and mass than a proton. In turn, a graviton is about 20 orders of magnitude smaller in size and mass than an elyson. Is this approximately correct?

Let's begin a Reality with the gravitational flux medium and the elysium medium. Since there is no place for the elysons to pile up and then respond to energy from the gravitational flux, we would not expect to see electromagnetic waves in the lcm. Also, we would not expect to see "Brownian Movement" among the elysons. Such movement has distinct directional moves, although constantly changing. Such movement is caused by distinct collisions and the gravitons are too small and numerous to cause any distinct shift in movement of an elyson.

We do observe that interstellar space has a temperature of a few degrees Kelvin. We measure this temperature by measuring the wave length of elysium waves. Logically the waves have originated in protonic matter, traveled a great distance and finally come into thermal equilibrium with the gravitational flux. Is this approximately correct?


Gregg Wilson

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Gregg</i>
<br />Presumably an elyson is about 20 orders of magnitude smaller in size and mass than a proton. In turn, a graviton is about 20 orders of magnitude smaller in size and mass than an elyson. Is this approximately correct?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">Make that about 5-7 orders of magnitude in size and about 20 orders in mass. Mass, of course, varies with the cube of size. If density increases with decreasing size, as it tends to do on average, the size difference may be even less than this estimate.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Since there is no place for the elysons to pile up and then respond to energy from the gravitational flux, we would not expect to see electromagnetic waves in the lcm.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">There are underwater waves, even though there is no place for water to pile up. However, to avoid that issue and still have our electromagnetic waves (which is the main function of elysium = lcm), just assume that elysons are contiguous and that gravitons apply pressure to them. So light waves are then pressure waves instead of density waves.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Also, we would not expect to see "Brownian Movement" among the elysons. Such movement has distinct directional moves, although constantly changing. Such movement is caused by distinct collisions and the gravitons are too small and numerous to cause any distinct shift in movement of an elyson.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">True. But graviton impacts deposit a lot of heat, so elysons do heat up, which must mean that whatever elysons are made from has increased its vibrational speed.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">We do observe that interstellar space has a temperature of a few degrees Kelvin. We measure this temperature by measuring the wave length of elysium waves. Logically the waves have originated in protonic matter, traveled a great distance and finally come into thermal equilibrium with the gravitational flux. Is this approximately correct?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">As any lightwave propagates, graviton drag continually robs it of energy and increases its wavelength progressively. That doesn't sound like thermal equilibrium to me.

Note that this might be my last post until Sept. 11 or later, unless I can get access while traveling. -|Tom|-

<hr noshade size="1">
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by tvanflandern</i>

There are underwater waves, even though there is no place for water to pile up. However, to avoid that issue and still have our electromagnetic waves (which is the main function of elysium = lcm), just assume that elysons are contiguous and that gravitons apply pressure to them. So light waves are then pressure waves instead of density waves.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<hr noshade size="1">

<i>We do not have any water in which there are no boundaries, either solid material or the water - air interface. So, how would a wave in water come into existence without there being an outside cause?</i>
<hr noshade size="1">

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">True. But graviton impacts deposit a lot of heat, so elysons do heat up, which must mean that whatever elysons are made from has increased its vibrational speed.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<hr noshade size="1">

<i>A graviton impact would impart momentum to an elyson. What evidence is there of internal elyson vibration? We use the term heat when there is a medium of particles in which all the particles are moving and colliding. I see no evidence of there being internal heat within an elyson. Its entire motion would contribute to there being heat in the Elysium medium.</i>

<i>Would you interpret that gravitons have heat?</i>
<hr noshade size="1">

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">As any lightwave propagates, graviton drag continually robs it of energy and increases its wavelength progressively. That doesn't sound like thermal equilibrium to me.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<hr noshade size="1">

<i>Okay, by implication the wave in the Elysium medium would finally dissipate entirely, due to friction with the graviton flux. If that is the case then how would a wave originate in the Elysium solely due to the graviton flux? One cannot have it both ways.</i>

Gregg Wilson