My pareidolia knows no bounds.

<b>[pareidoliac] "The void has consciousness. It doesn't need concepts like time/space/logic."</b>

(I think I met him once - a real air head.) If that particular consciousness does not need those particular concepts then it probably won't conceive of them. Another consciousness might need them however, in which case it probably would conceive of them. Each of us is unique.

<b>[pareidoliac] "Time and space are real concepts but are not real."</b>

You identified which real you meant for the first real, so I presume you meant the other one (physical) for the second real. I have reached a similar conclusion but I'm not ready to claim that it has been proven. How would you do that?

You could have said 'Time and space are real (concept) but are not real (physical).' This wording removes the ambiguity, but shows that the word 'real' is not contributing much. So a better wording would be 'Time and space are concepts but are not physical.'

It occurs to me that without space, there can be no physical existence (ie: no "where" for it to be).

LB said[pareidoliac] "Time and space are real concepts but are not real."

You identified which real you meant for the first real, so I presume you meant the other one (physical) for the second real. I have reached a similar conclusion but I'm not ready to claim that it has been proven. How would you do that?

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Pareidoliac- Its proven because the ideas of time and space are unnecessarily complicated compared to time and space being embedded in the here and now and infinitesimal "size" as posited by Parmenides + David Bohm and the visionary William Blake (universe in a grain of sand). We are unique but our essence is universal. The bigger the front the bigger the back (see Georges. Ohsawa). Ultimately eastern philosophy depicts reality. All is Mu (Nothing). Western philosophy depicts a dualistic (Descartian) man made interpretation of reality. all is Moooooooooooo from the Brahmin cattle and people herders and breeders who gave us all our "great" Abrahamic religions + Buddhism. 3 guys fighting forever while the 4th looks at the wall in protest.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by pareidoliac</i>
<br />Things are not separate any more than a whirlpool is separate. A thing like a whirlpool is a pattern. When it can no longer maintain it's integrity it starts returning to the dimension from which it came. We were all in this dimension before birth. We were not born into the universe but reassembled into the only universe.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I will have to think about this before commenting. What about consciousness? Is there only one, or are there many (7 billion and counting)?

Do we each have independent consciousness or do we each have "receivers" which enable each of us to "tune-in" to the single consciousness?

If our individual consciousness's are linked (or instances of one "master" consciousness), why would there be, in general, no signals received when individuals known to us become unconscious (ie: dead)?

OK, this is getting way too far off topic. Yes it is interesting. Sorry I brought it up.

If there is a demand for this we can start a new topic elsewhere. Let me know. But for now lets get back to - ahem - reality.

LB

Reality is what is. (Except for Bill Clinton). To perceive reality one must remove his/her senses. Now one perceives there is no blue in reality. There are electromagnetic waves in a certain frequency. etc...in Newtonian terms.