EXISTENCE (not creation) Ex Nihilo

North:
I don't agree with it either. I was being sarcastic a bit. I just don't think God can be put into a box so easily. I believe in God, and He believes in me!

Duane Brown

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by DWB</i>
<br />North:
I don't agree with it either. I was being sarcastic a bit. I just don't think God can be put into a box so easily. I believe in God, and He believes in me!

Duane Brown

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
But if 'He' doesn't exist, where does that leave you?

Messiah:

I would die happy in knowing that I have lived my life according to the wisdom found in the Gospel. It has added so much to my life that I could not have experienced otherwise and would not trade for anything. I would leave this world looking forward to something wonderful. Not a bad way to exit.

Duane Brown

I really can't believe you are still trying to keep this alive.

Are you just phishing in hopes that I'll chime in and give you all the answers again? What, do you really think I'm that stupid?

I knew you would get about this far and then hit the wall, I told you that! Too bad you weren't a little more upfront, I probably would be willing to help you out.

What a joke you and all your persona are.

Good Luck! [V]

Patrick[]

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by DWB</i>
<br />North:
I don't agree with it either. I was being sarcastic a bit. I just don't think God can be put into a box so easily. I believe in God, and He believes in me!

Duane Brown

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

If this is a confessional I will chime in a bit. I too believe in the Gospels and at the same time believe your statement God=Universe and Universe=God. I am a Christian Pantheist and theistic evolutionist. However, if you want to discuss Cosmology, it is best to leave God out of it. Science requires empirical evidence, when discussing God you will always be discussing faith, not empirical evidence. Anytime someone uses "because God did it" without any proof, you will lose credibility. No matter how hard you try, you will never prove God exists, it is all about faith. If you want to combine an ethic with science you are talking ontology...this is a cosmology board.

But, if you are interested...look here. It needs a lot of work, but you will get the idea.

meaning-of-life.info/beginningsoftheuniverse.html

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by rousejohnny</i>

If this is a confessional I will chime in a bit. I too believe in the Gospels and at the same time believe your statement God=Universe and Universe=God. I am a Christian Pantheist and theistic evolutionist. However, if you want to discuss Cosmology, it is best to leave God out of it. Science requires empirical evidence, when discussing God you will always be discussing faith, not empirical evidence. Anytime someone uses "because God did it" without any proof, you will lose credibility. No matter how hard you try, you will never prove God exists, it is all about faith. If you want to combine an ethic with science you are talking ontology...this is a cosmology board.

But, if you are interested...look here. It needs a lot of work, but you will get the idea.

meaning-of-life.info/beginningsoftheuniverse.html
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Empirical evidence is not needed to prove 1+1=2.
There are facets of religion and contemporary science which fly in the face of simple logic.

i.e.:

In order to change or be changed, something must first exist. This is means change is a function of existence, NOT the reverse. Existence is not a function of cause and effect. It is a principle - not a process - which resolves the enigma.